"Let Pagans Play" - EXPONENTIAL Book Excerpt

The following is an excerpt from our new book EXPONENTIAL: How You And Your Friends Can Start A Missional Church Movement that will be on shelves in 6 days, but you can order online right now.

LET PAGANS PLAY

"Many of our artists play in local bands or perform in community theater companies.  Since we encourage people at all stages of spiritual growth to use their art for God we have lots of artists who are recruited by other artists and begin doing their art before they become Christ followers.  We’re not only OK with that, we encourage it.  We have one campus that has been very successful in encouraging people playing in outside bands to come to church and play in the worship bands. They have recruited two entire bands that way. Not to mention that as result of the relationships that have been formed in these bands, a number of people have come to follow Jesus!

Next time you’re in a public place take a look around.  If you are in a public place right now, go ahead and take a look.  Research tells us that thirty percent of the people you see have significant artistic gifts.  That’s 3 out of 10.  And sadly enough most of them don’t think they have a place in the church.  Yet those are the very people who you need along with your friends to catalyze and sustain a missional movement.  So, go over and ask one of them to join you.  Now.  Seriously."

In 6 days EXPONENTIAL: How You And Your Friends Can Start A Missional Church Movement will be available in bookstores.  You can order it online right now.  You can also join myself and Jon for a 30-day conversation on our new book where you will get content drops, videos and additional question and answers through Daily Digital.

Comments

[Bill]

Jon will say that was from me, but in actuality, he coined those three words after I explained the premise. (And I actually remember him being very pleased with himself when he thought of it.)

[Glenna]

Dave, this is so intriguing. But please help me with this: I view people "leading" worship on sundays/saturdays as "leaders" - helping to lead the rest of us into true worship of God. And if that is accurate, leaders need to show the way (not perfectly), be true worshippers of God themselves, so we can emulate that, learn from it, etc. Am I missing something in your picture?

[Kathie]

I completely agree with Glenna. The people on the platform should be lead worshipers and it is not possible to do that if you are not a Christ follower. Further, I find it strange that we expect our students in Blast bands to complete a 3 page application about their commitment, faith and walk with God but we encourage non-Christians to lead worship during our weekend services.

[Dave Ferguson]

Thanks for the comments. Let me respond to all three comments so far:

1. Bill, at the beginning of this section in our book, Exponential we credit you with these insights. You, more than anyone helped set this into the DNA of COMMUNITY. Thanks!

2.Glenna, good question. Kathie, I think this will help you understand better. In the excerpt we did not say we let non-Christians lea worship; but we did say we let them participate. Who ever is leading the worship at any COMMUNITY location will be a Christ follower and have the same expectations as other leaders. But we will have people playing in the band who are not there yet. Our Arts Directors are really concerned with the spiritual direction of each band member; are they growing closer to God in Christ Jesus or not. Hope that helps.

[Scott Smith]

Dave - Great excerpt. Can't wait to get the book!

There is a lot of debate on the topic Glenna brought up, and I can appreciate her concerns. I've seen it handled different ways, and I can say the approach you describe works great. I'm a drummer, and I've seen musicians brought in that ended up coming to salvation through playing with us. What better way to see how Christian community works than by plunking someone right in the middle of it?!

[Bill]

Totally Dave. You guys were very kind in the book. I was just giving Jon the due credit for those 3 words. I can remember the moment he said them.

[Glenna]

Dave - your response is helpful re the distinction between who's actually leading and who's playing along. That makes sense, and I think I can go there, especially knowing that the leader is watching out for his/her flock/band. I'm thinking that at some point, either the pagan follows the leader spiritually, or likely drops out? Cuz would you want that to be a permanent pagan position?? ya know? I love where I know your heart is in this, Dave, and I want to see the Church move more in this direction of being that place where sinners gather - and yeah, we sure do keep on sinning. But I'm wondering, are there other places, other formats, where pagans can play that isn't on stage sundays -- and how does that "stage" mess with the whole performance thing as well, which is such a big issue for worship music in general. Just thinking out loud.

[Dave Ferguson]

Glenna, absolutely there are other places that they can play. The key is that we have Christian artists using their God-given gifts along side (not yet Christian) pagan artists using their God-given gifts.

One of the things that excites me the most about the new conversation regarding the church being more missional is that it will challenge Christian artists to be performing in pubs, bars and other places where they can build relationships with those far from God.

[Patricia]

While I understand what you're saying, I have to disagree with this concept. Further, I don't believe you addressed one of the most important parts of the comment by Kathie regarding StuCo.

Here's the thing - when a student wants to play for StuCo Blast, that student is required to complete a comprehensive application detailing their spiritual background, current walk with Jesus and recommendations/references from people in the church. It seems to me that if this is what we require of our students, we should require NOTHING less from adults. It is said that kids/teens learn by example. Seems like the example here is being set by the students and their leaders rather than the adults.

I believe that those we place on the platform for worship, whether they are "leading" in the form of singing or "leading" in the form of playing any instrument, should be Christ-followers.

Your reply states that we let anyone participate in worship but there is a huge difference between those participating in the congregation and those participating on the platform. Like it or not, everyone on the platform is leading worship. Each member of the team is as important as the person singing the melody. As such, each person should be a Christ follower. People in the congregation are participating and being led by all those on the platform. This participation is not the same as participating as a member of the worship team.

I am not trying to say by my comments that those on worship teams are more important than those in the seats. But I do believe strongly that those participating as members of the worship team/band should be Christ followers.

[Dave Ferguson]

Patricia & Kathie - I think you just disagree with me. Thanks for the comment!